Episode 139 – Pat Flynn: How To Use Your Gift To Serve Others

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

What’s up DreamNation. We are back again. And today’s episode is one that I’ve been waiting on for months on it. Not only for me, but trust me when I say for you as well, we have the man, I don’t even want to say the myths because he’s here, but the legend, my brother, mr. Pat Flynn, Pat, you want to go ahead and say what’s up to DreamNation.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

What’s a DreamNation! Cass, thanks so much for having me. I’m super stoked to be here. very excited about all the things we’re going about. We’re about to talk about.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Oh, yes, absolutely. And I want to start off. I always love to give people the proper introduction and the way that I do this is I compare us as entrepreneurs and thought leaders to superheroes.

Why? It’s because we’re constantly flying around the world, we’re putting on our Cape and we’re trying to solve the biggest problems for you. You’ve been a superhero to me and many other entrepreneurs, but behind every superhero, let’s just use Superman. For example, there is a Clark Kent. So my question to you is behind the superhero of Pat Flynn. Who is that Clark Kent?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I love it, dude. I love this. I thought you were gonna ask me what my kryptonite is, which I’m sure we’ll get to later, but, my. Clark Kent is I’m a father and a husband. I live in San Diego, California. I have two wonderful kids and they are my life. They’re my everything. And I’m so thankful that in 2008 I had my dream job.

I got let go from it. I didn’t know what to do. And I’m very thankful. I got let go, because now fast forward, I discovered this world with entrepreneurship. And although I show up every day and I am here to provide value to my audience and to everybody and to all of you listening and watching right now, I am so thankful that I can decompress right here at home and be here with my wife and my kids and play games and teach them about life, teach them life skills, show them using my example that You can do whatever you want and you have options.

You just need to get through all those things that I was conditioned to think that I was supposed to be. And you need to discover who you are. And so me and my wife, April, our job is to just show our kids that they have all the options in the world, but to inspire them to believe in themselves, to inspire them, to understand that they can achieve things no matter what their dream is, it’s just going to take some work.

It’s going to take failure. And these are all things that we learn as entrepreneurs that I’m trying to instill, not just on them, not just to my audience, but I have big dreams myself. I want to be an agent of change in the world of entrepreneurship and kids. I want to change how school is done. I think all schools should have entrepreneurship.

These are the things that are going on in my brain every day. How can I become a massive wave of change for people in. How we teach our kids the skills that are going to be so important, moving forward, especially as things move over to a little bit more robotic and AI and whatnot. The thing that’s going to help us is what’s human soft skills, the creativity, the relationships, and all those little things.

And that’s what my passion is right now, too, beyond obviously business and whatnot. I’m also, I am a big marching band nerd, a big Back To The Future nerd. just nerd in general, I love superhero analogies because I’m big into Marvel and all that sort of stuff too.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah. And star Wars in the back

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

ton of star Wars stuff in the back as well.

Yep. And, I’m just a super nerd, I guess, at the same time. So that’s who I am off of, off of the business stuff.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Man. I love it. One thing I want to ask you and I heard it, I’m gonna give you the credit. Cause I heard you ask this to someone in a podcast one time, did you, do you think that, did you say back in the day that you were going to be where you are today and the way that you asked it was like, it was this your vision early on.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

No, it was not my vision. My vision when I was in school, high school and college was to be a world famous architect. That’s what I went to school for. That’s what I was hustling on in my job as a career, as an architect. And I was putting in 80 hour weeks to impress my boss to add to my resume, taking all these tests and exams to try and fast forward my way to start I’m in the world of architecture.

And like I said, in 2008, I got let go. And it was the best thing to ever happen to me because I’m able to now use these superpowers and this drive to help even more people and to discover more ways that I can serve others too. And that’s just what I’m all about right now. no, I didn’t know that this is where I was going to go.

And in fact, I still don’t know exactly where we’re going to go, but now having these visions of education and knowing that I can actually achieve these things too, now I’ve gotten over what I was conditioned. To be, which was perfect. I thought I had to be perfect all along the way. I would come home from school with a 97% of my test and my dad would be like, okay, what happened to you at the 3%?

And we worked for three hours on the things that I got wrong, not really appreciating the things that I got right. Now I’m realizing it’s gotta be the opposite, especially if you’re an entrepreneur and you’re a dreamer, you have to realize that there’s going to be hiccups. There’s going to be. curve balls thrown your way.

There’s going to be brick walls, send at you, and you’re going to have to discover your way up and around them or under them. And you can’t do this alone either is the other big thing, which is why I’m so glad that you and I get to connect today because now we’re building relationship and everybody listening.

We’re building a relationship with each other too, because the more people that can put their heads together that share the same values and share the same love, amazing things can happen in we’re here to make the internet and this world a better place together. Man.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

The one thing is why I respect you so much is because you’ve shown a vulnerability, but you’ve also shown that it’s uncomfortable, right?

Because right now, I think when it was like day, maybe 15 of the quarantine that you were doing live on YouTube, and one day you were going to show how it looks. When you go live and a good friend that we have in common is Shaleen. and you were talking about how Shaleen just goes live directly from it and everybody’s on there.

It’s by, 89, 90, maybe even 150 people, which I know is a big gap, but there was a good amount of people on there and you’re still in the background. And yet. Man. And for anybody who’s watching this right now, basically he’s getting pumped up. My question to you is how have you been able to keep going through every day when it looks like that you’re showing you had the same fears that we all do?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I still fear. I still get nervous every single morning. So I go live on YouTube every morning. At least I have so far for 156 days straight. And literally before I go, before I hit broadcast, I still do. I’m nervous. I still get the sweats just like I do when I go on stage, just like I do before. I’m about to go on an interview.

But I’ve learned over time that nervousness, that sweat, that sort of anxiety is a result of being excited about what I’m about to do. I’m actually changing the story in my brain. In fact, the same parts of your brain fire up when you’re fearful about something. And when you’re excited about something, it’s just the story that you tell yourself about those feelings that you’re feeling.

So now, in fact, when I’m doing anything, I look toward. Where man, where I’m going to be nervous if I’m not a little bit nervous, that’s when I get more nervous. If that makes sense. That’s what, I’m a little worried because it means me. Maybe I’m not pushing myself hard enough. In fact, most of the most awesome things that have happened to me.

And I know for anybody listening to this, this is true. The best things happen right outside your comfort zone. And so it’s going to be that internal battle between, I feel safe here, but then all the great things are happening over there. I need to put myself out there, but it’s scary.

So this is where support systems come into play. This is where, mini micro experiments come into play. And just again, removing those limiting beliefs and understanding that failure and mistakes is a part of the process. And as long as you’re failing forward, You’re still making progress. And me, it’s just, I still get nervous and I’ve realized that I’m never going to get rid of those nerves.

It’s not even after 156 days of doing this, I still get nervous. But I, again, I think that’s a sign that this is still important to me and I want to do it well.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

No. And I hear you there. I just had this conversation with a good buddy of mine last night. And I had the conversation briefly this morning, my barber, he had asked do I still get nervous when guests come onto the show?

And I was like, I don’t think I get it as much, but just like you said, it shows that it’s still important to me. So before we go live, especially when you’re doing a video one, I feel like it’s your time to shine because. Every guest that’s coming on there. They want that same energy for the show to go well.

And how do you lead with that? And so my question to you is, especially for people who are leading these podcasts right now, and maybe they don’t have the big guests yet, but they want to go after them. Do you still, I get nervous when people come onto your show?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Oh, yeah, absolutely. Cause like you said, I want to deliver value for them while they’re there.

I want to showcase them. I want to make them look like a hero. And it’s my job as the person who’s doing the interview to ask the right questions, to set them up properly because I want it to be a win for them as well. Especially if it’s somebody who. Perhaps took a while to get on or is a huge name. I remember when Tim Ferris came on, I was so nervous.

This is episode 51 out of 460 that have been up that, Tim Ferriss was on. And I fanboyed for the first 10 minutes because I was so nervous. I was a little bit embarrassing to listen to. I just couldn’t stop thanking him and talking about him and. I was like, Oh wait, Oh yeah. I have a duty here to actually pull this information out of you for my audience as well.

But it was a fun fanboy type of moment. And I try to hold back sometimes, but I do get nervous when a person comes on, because I know that they’ve been on. Perhaps dozens, if not hundreds of other shows as well, and they’ve been featured everywhere. So part of my role as interviewer is also understanding that this is an opportunity for me to also build a relationship with these people at the same time, and many of these things where we meet for the first time on a podcast, a lot of these people have become my best friends, Chalene Johnson, Chris Ducker.

So many others we’ve connected via podcast. And as a result, They are now my friends, you can’t help, but build the relationship with somebody. If you’re having genuine, honest and authentic conversations for half hour or an hour or whatnot, it just naturally happens. And in fact, I teach a lot of people how to podcast and one of the number, one reasons why people want to start a podcast I found in our surveys is because they want to connect.

With other people, at the same time, I will say that if you’re a podcaster and you were struggling to get big names into your show, don’t feel like you have to have big names on your show to have your show be impactful. In fact, even have more impact by having people who are just a few steps ahead of where most of your audience is.

And in fact, most of my. Most popular episodes are with people nobody’s ever heard of before, because they best represent the community of listeners. And they’re just people just like them, like episode 122 with Shane and Jocelyn Sams. Two teachers from Kentucky. Shane was mid Mo listening to mid mowing his lawn, listening to the smart, passive income podcast stopped halfway through told Jocelyn, this is gonna, this is the guy we’re going to follow.

Put action into place and now have built a multiple, a million dollar business as a result of following my work. When they told that story, it’s everybody’s listening to the show right then and there. And these two humble people from Kentucky and do a better job of teaching people. Then people like Tim Ferris, Gary Vaynerchuk, although they’re awesome too.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah, no, I think that’s so monumental when you say that, because a lot of the times we don’t think about the people who are just a couple steps ahead of us. We all want those big names. And I don’t know if it’s because we want validation that our show is big enough or something, because it seems like that people want to do business with other people who are already doing business in that way.

So it’s That’s something that I think I sat out with in the beginning  like, I wanted really big names, but I would agree that some of my more impactful shows where people who are just like me, that you feel like, understand your journey a little bit more and you know their. So I think that’s crucial.

And I’m glad that you said it. One thing I want to talk about is you have been very outright and forth of, Hey, I’m a father and I’m just like you, as you look at this and the business that you’ve built for your son, Does it become hard to balance if he’s, because now he’s being exposed to podcasting, YouTubing, everything, and he wants to do all of these things as well, but then you still also know that it’s you have to have that social aspect of it.

And I feel like kids, if you’re not already grown to understand how to separate it, certain kids, like I can only speak about CJ. My son they’ll go all in. Do you feel like that you’re able to have that balance and in turn, does that help you to be able to make sure that he has that balance?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Yeah, I mean, you’re right.

My son is 10 and I have a daughter who’s seven as well, and they’re very much watching YouTube and they have their favorite YouTubers were watching Twitch. In fact, my son and my daughter and I, we stream three days a week on Twitch while we play Fortnite and other games together. It’s fun bonding time, but it’s also a great.

Time to parent and teach people about what it’s like to interact with people who were there live watching with you, what it’s like to create content for the purposes of creating content, not just to play games and my son getting involved with the podcast that he and I have together called all of your bees wax and some other fun things we do together.

it’s a lot of fun. And for me, I try to get my kids involved in what I do as much as possible. Not like. have them show up and actually be on camera all the time, but I want to expose them to how I do what I do. And more importantly, why I do what I do. And this was very apparent when I was speaking a lot and traveling to different places.

Like when I grew up, my dad would just be I’m going on a business trip, I’m gone. And then he’s gone for a week. And then I’m like, okay. And then he comes back. It’s okay, work equals. Time away from my father. So that’s not cool for me. I wanted work to bring me and my kids together. So it’s like, Hey kids, come in the room.

Let me show you this conference I’m going to speak at, this is what the venue looks like. This is where I’m going to be speaking. And here are the kinds of people who were there. And this is why it’s really important to me, for me to show up and why I’m in this office, rehearsing this presentation about this, because these people need help.

And I have this knowledge and I’m able to help them. I’m almost at the same time, getting permission from them. To go and actually help people. So now they’re seeing me as an example to do that. And then of course they see on social media, the people clapping and getting excited and getting value.

And I share that too. And I’m like, see? When you help others, great things happen. And of course, I also share how the business is going and how it’s progressing. And some of the rewards that are being reached as a result of serving other people first. And that’s just something I’m trying to instill in them.

we also know that there’s a lot of dangers online as well with really nasty people, bad people, trolls, and whatnot. And my wife and I, we had a way of really serious discussion with my son County before he started his YouTube channel, or we started it for hint for him. And it was like a video channel where he could just pop up some of his projects on there.

And he, we, he learned how to edit his own videos. He learned how to publish them, which is like super cool. The kids get, they get excited about that. They were like, Oh my gosh, we have to edit a new video. I’m like, no, If you like it, like here, let’s give you more resources. Let’s buy you some books.

Here’s some tutorials that you can check out like wherever their energy is. And we want to support that. And, we had a serious chat with him because we knew, and I knew, especially that there’s trolls and haters out there that are going to try and pull it you down. We live in this world. What I like to call a bucket of crabs, where a lot of the people that are around us when we try to, if you get a bucket of live crabs, You don’t ever have to worry about any of the crabs crawling out, because as soon as one tries to crawl out the other crabs, pull them back down with their big pinchers.

And this is the kind of world we live in, unfortunately, where whenever we try to progress and we try to step into something new, we have other people who are maybe not where we’re wanting to go. Pull us back down to where they’re at and whether they’re right, doing it on purpose or not. That’s generally how it feels sometimes.

And it’s really important to surround yourself with people who are going to lift you up. anyway, in teaching my son, these lessons were like, Hey, you’re going to get some people who are going to perhaps say some negative things when you put yourself out there. And a lot of times when you are expressing yourself and you’re putting yourself out there, you’re going to attract people who are going to say things because they’re hurt people is what I want to learn.

And so we instill these lessons in him and then, not two months later, one of his videos actually goes viral. It’s like this carnival game out of cardboard that he built. And it was a common earlier. In fact, he ran downstairs. He was like, mommy, daddy, how do I delete this comment? And I was like, what is a bad comment?

He’s like, yeah, it’s pretty bad. Can you come and tell me how to delete it? Cause we never taught them how to do that. And I go up and I read the comment and the comment again, my sons was nine at the time the comment said kill yourself. And I was like, what? who would do this? Who would say that? And I asked my son like.

What do you think of this comment? And my son goes, I hope he’s okay. And I was like, dude, thank you.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

That’s when you know you’re doing it the right way.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

It’s not about him. It’s about this person who’s feeling hurt. And then he was like, but can you teach me how to delete it please? Cause I don’t want it on my channel.

I was like, okay. Okay. we’ll delete it for you. But, I was so proud of him that moment because those lessons that we teach our kids are like sponges dude. And the more we can lead by example, the more they’re going to show up in times like that too, when maybe we’re not going to be there to overlook their shoulder all the time.

And it’s these lessons that we still instill in them now that will continue to be there and we will be there with them even though we’re not there.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah, no, I, and I’m going through that same battle right now. What I mean by that is how do I continue to instill what I’ve learned is level five leadership, right?

Which is again, just trying to teach him as in three years from now I’m not around. And it’s not only with video games and things like that, but it’s also in school. every morning I say two things to CJ. We say, or I ask him, what are the two things? And he’ll say, be great, be a leader. And I’ve always wanted him to know those things because in life, like you said, there’s a lot of hurt people out there and they’ll lash out.

Not because they want to hurt you, but just because they’re hurt and they’re trying to find a way to channel it. And so if you could teach your kid that at a very young age to where they say, Hey, you know what, I understand where you’re coming from and I don’t take it personal, most of the time people will back off that.

There’ll be like, that, I’m done with this conversation and you’re like, no, I get it. you’re hurting. So I respect that you said that. One thing I wanted to ask you though, is, are you okay if he was to say, and this is a conversation that I had with a friend, I’m interested to hear what you have to say.

If he says dad, I don’t want to go to college. I don’t want to. All I want to do is be a YouTuber or Fortniter or something like that. Seeing as you’ve Built a business around an audience and being online primarily. Are you okay with that?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I’m okay. If he chooses. With reason not to go to college. Me and my wife have had extensive conversations about that.

If, where he wants to go in his career, College would support that. Then of course we would encourage that. But if where he wants to go and where his energy is and where he wants to hustle is not that, then that’s fine. Now, if he were to say, Hey, I want to be a Fort Fortnite or whatever, I would probably go, all right, sell it to me.

Tell me your plan. How are you going to make a living doing this? And I will have him sell it to me if he can sell it to me. Awesome. Go do it. I think that even if you were to fail, that’s going to be a big lesson that he will take with him moving forward. Not a, Hey, I told you so lesson, that’s not cool.

It’s more of a, Oh, I didn’t realize it was this hard or it was like this, or I didn’t realize that people who stream everyday are literally streaming for 12 hours. Get hardly any sleep and are suffering mentally. And this is a hard game that a lot of people play. So you have to show up and communicate with your audience and all this stuff.

Like you don’t really know what it’s like until you’re in it. And one of the best teachers that I’ve had his experience, and if that’s where his energy is, and he wants to put it there, I will support him. And I’m going to be there, whether he succeeds or fails. And when he’s, when he asks for help and we’re just going to continually let him and his sister know that we will be there when you need it.

But we’re not going to tell you what to do. We will show you what your options are. We will hopefully paint things in a way that are understandable for you and you go make those decisions yourself, because that’s going to be a much bigger lesson. In my opinion, then us just commanding from the top, the mountain, go do this, don’t do this.

Go do that. and that’s the way that I grew up was very traditional and I’m half Filipino. Very Filipino is to go, Oh, you’re like, when you’re 12, you’re like already going to be a nurse or a doctor or a lawyer. It’s like already in your plan for that to happen. And for me, it was architecture because it was a very prestigious career.

And I did enjoy it in fact, but again, very thankful I got, let go. What were those two questions? questions, or mantras you told your son every morning at school? Cause I really liked what you said there was. Yeah, it’s

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

be great. And be a leader. And so being great at, we talk about this and it’s funny, cause I just heard him, he just came home from school and he’s right outside of here.

but. The long story, short being great is being the best version of yourself, right? So he understands these he’s nine, and he just turned nine, but that means that you don’t need to go out there and try to impact the world. But if you become the best version of yourself, you will impact someone. And then it has a ripple effect.

If your energy is all the way authentic. And so he completely understands that. And being a leader, I think at such a young age, it’s so easy. I mean, we do it even now. Social media is definitely propelling us to do it, but we’re always having to. Play the comparison game, right? So at a young age, just be a leader because nowadays I feel like for a lot of kids, they do things, but it’s because they’ve seen their friends do it.

And so I tell CJ and it’s Hey, you do know right and wrong because your mom and I talked to you about that. You have a young sister, she is going to be watching you. So be a leader, not only. For the classroom, but be a leader for your sister. Cause if anything was to ever happen to me, you’re next in line.

And so that’s been something that we’ve done now for, I would say three years and he definitely gets it. And so right when he’s getting out, I’m like, Hey, what are we going to do? He’s be great, be a leader.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I love it. We do something similar with our kids. We ask them questions, one at the start of their school day.

When at the end, the one at the start of the school day, as soon as they’re leaving the car, I’m like, Who are you going to help today? They have somebody in mind or they are thinking of somebody, maybe a friend that is going through rough time. Or a lot of times it’s their teachers are like, Hey, I’m going to help mrs.

with some of the cleanup after school today. I might be a little late coming out and just like trying to instill like service to others first and you will be rewarded. And then at the end of the day, this is my favorite thing. I, at the end of the day I go, so what can you teach me? basically having them and empowering them to go, Oh, like you don’t know everything, dad.

let me teach you. And it’s Hey, we’re at the same level here. I’m teaching you stuff. You’re teaching me stuff. Now there’s a reason to go to school. They have that immediate reward after school of being able to share something that they’ve learned to somebody who’s close to them who can just, and I’m just trying to encourage that as well.

And that, and they light up, dude. They light up. They’re teaching me about. Whatever insects. They were like dissecting at school or whatever. it doesn’t really matter. The fact that they’re, I’m excited to teach others another version of service and especially to a parent who usually is more of an, a commanding position to be a little bit more, Hey, no, you teach me something and we’re working, going together like that.

That’s one of my favorite things. So thank you for sharing yours with me and I’m, and hopefully, maybe this helps others.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Oh, yes, it definitely will. And you actually just helped me. Yeah. And the reason why I say that is because one of the things I asked CJ every day when he comes home, is what did you learn new today?

I think that your, the way that you ask that is even better because it is just, like you said, it empowers them to say, Oh wait, I can teach you something. That’s right. And then there are, then they instantly that the value that you have in this world, it is because of the problems that you could solve and the way that you solve any problem is obviously you have to be able to teach someone something and educate them.

So I liked that even more. That was what was going through my mind. I already know that I asked this, but what can you teach me today? I think is a better way to ask it. So thank you for that as well.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Yeah, absolutely. I added it. It meant that somebody told it to me, I’m just passing it forward. So

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

yeah.

Yeah, no, that’s what we all do. I mean, nothing is new under the sun for the most part. It has a tweak. And then if you don’t share it, no one else is able to benefit from it. So I want to. Segment this a little bit, because for the people that are listening right now, I’m sure they love it, but if they don’t have kids and they’re trying to start a business and that’s where you’ve been a pioneer in helping people get that business, that vision, that dream off the ground, I want to go there.

And the first thing that I want to know, and this is from my own curious benefit, have you always been able to be the leader that you are because. I’ll give context on this. I think where a lot of people start out, they want to be the entrepreneur, But we start out as solopreneurs and why we struggle and we can’t get past level two, three, whatever is because we don’t really understand the power of a team or how to delegate and be a good leader.

Did you ever struggle with this?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Absolutely. I mean, on paper, if you look at it, it took me seven years to hire my first person to help me with something. I was doing everything myself. And I think there’s different stages of leadership. We need to also, leadership is important for yourself. You need to be a leader to yourself.

You need to be disciplined. You need to honor the calendar and the time blocking that you’re putting into your schedule, that’s being a leader too, as opposed to having other things guide you like YouTube rabbit holes or other distractions and whatnot. So stepping up for you is important. That’s phase one and that’s, A really important thing to do, especially if you’re just a solo entrepreneur.

that’s the kind of leadership for yourself that you need to step into first, before you can even lead others. It’s similar to the thing it’s like, how can you love it? There’s if you don’t first love yourself. how can you lead others if you don’t first lead yourself either? So it’s a very similar thing.

And it again, like I said, it took me seven years to finally start, to get comfortable with hiring people, to do things. And where I found most of my, success was actually hiring people to do things that I loved to do liked to do was good at, but shouldn’t do as the CEO of the company, I was very much a scrappy entrepreneur sort of Frankenstein, putting things together as they came through and I was able to make it work, but I was wearing all the hats.

And as a result I had. the ability to, like there was a fork in the road where I could either stop growing, but I had so many more people to serve so that wasn’t going get going to happen, or I could keep doing what I was doing and trying to help more people with just me and eventually get to the point, like many of my other friends, including my friend, Chris Ducker, who I know you’ve spoken to before he was hospitalized, because he was so overwhelmed and burned himself out from work.

And that’s an option that a lot of people don’t consciously choose, but that’s what they choose to go down. Or you could finally get comfortable hiring others, people and learning how to lead a team. Part of being a great leader in my opinion, is to not always consider it as you’re at the top of mountain and talking down and just telling people what to do for me leadership.

And what I love about my team is I’ve empowered my team members to own certain pieces of the brand, such that they are responsible, that they have a say. That in fact, I am just the sounding board for what they think they can do to make that segment of the brand better. And as a result, and especially over the last couple years, hiring now seven full time employees, including all the benefits and pay and like a 401k, all those things.

Like I feel like they’re my family now. What’s cool. Is they feel like my audience is theirs too. And as a result, they take better care of them than they were when they were just contractors. working for me. And now we all together can come together to build some amazing things, including a new membership program, much more higher quality courses.

better connections with the audience, live event in San Diego last year that we put together with five hundred people who flew down. I don’t know when that’s going to happen again because of Corona, but we’ll see. And just amazing things happen when you finally start letting go. And that’s really what I had to do.

To be a leader and to help more people, I had to let go of things. And it’s interesting because my first book I ever wrote was called Let Go. It was called Let Go, because I was let go from my job. But I also had to let go of who I thought I was supposed to be as an architect and somebody who is supposed to be perfect and somebody who wasn’t in business school, but that’s the direction I went.

But even now, and even today, I still have to learn to let go of things, because I want my focus and energy to be on things that only I can do because the team can help support that too. It has been a big learning curve for me to have people working under me. It has added a lot of pressure because these are families now with kids who, if I don’t step up and do what I need to do, then it affects their lives as well.

So even more meaningful, but at the same time, seeing them. step up to help people in a way that I would too. It’s just wow, this is an amazing thing that’s happening. And also letting them, like I used to, with my first hires, I used to micromanage. And in fact, I would spend more time focused on how to help.

That person helped me, that it was actually I’m might as well have not hired them at all. I would have had more time if I didn’t hire them because I was micromanaging so much. And then I had to let go and go, this is. Your specialty, you own that. I won’t touch it. That’s yours and we’ve all together because we have the same mission and values to help turn dreamers into achievers.

We can get behind that together. And that’s been really cool to see.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

End I asked that question because I think that a lot of people, myself included, you’re trying to figure out how you can take your business to the next level. And one thing that was said to me, and this was by a, I don’t know, do you know Mike Michalowicz is?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Mike Michalowicz yeah, I interviewed him recently.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah. Mike on too. And Mike gave me, it was profound. He gave us, I should say, because anyone who’s listening, he gave us some pretty profound information. When he said for delegation, he struggled as he figured out one thing. And he said, instead of. Cause when most people think of delegating, they think of a task.

It’s I need you to do this task. He was like, but we’re starting to turn around for me was I thought of delegation as an outcome. And he was like, so here’s basically you give that team member an outcome of what you want. And then you say, here’s the two things that I need you to do. I need you to make sure that it’s done, time efficiently.

and then there was one other thing which basically was like, you be creative. He was like, so what happened if they come back to you? And they say, Hey, what do you want? And he’s yeah, no. Remember what we talked about. Like I trust in your ability to get this done and deliver this outcome rather than this one specific task.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I love that this reminds me of another story that I once heard about. I don’t remember what war it was, but it was some war where the commander was telling their generals out in the fields to do here’s step one, do this step two, do this. this is the path to follow that we can use to win the war.

And they were losing all the battles. And then one day the commander was like, you know what, let me get, let me leave it up to the generals to figure out how to do this. All I need to tell the generals is what’s called the commander’s intent. this is what you teach your teammates. Hey, the intent of this is to get here.

However you want it, do this in the best way that you can think possible. Go do that. I don’t care. Just if you’re going to spend a certain amount of money to do it, let me know. But other than that have at it, this is yours. The intent, however, is we want to end up here. And this commander’s intense style of teaching and leading has been really amazing because again, it empowers the team to step up and feel ownership to something.

And when you can recognize the good work that they do as well, this is something that I feel I have excelled at and done really well in the business and with my crew is that, I can recognize when somebody does something, even if it’s small and I can let them know about that. And sometimes you don’t need to shower them with gifts or gift cards or anything.

It just want to be recognized. And when I, and that’s something that I didn’t get when I was in architecture. And that was actually the first thing that really drew me to entrepreneurship because here I was as a job captain in a world, renowned architecture firm doing drafts and managing projects. And I never really got thanked for the work.

It was just like, Work. And then here at what is helping people pass the lead exam, which is like some unknown exam in the architecture space. And people were sending me handwritten letters, thanking me for helping them pass their exam and get a raise or promotion at their job. Calling me by name. I was like, wow, I’m having way more impact and making more money doing this entrepreneurial thing then was that my nine to five where it was supposed to be this prestigious job that was going to lead me to a secure.

and, financially, off career. And of course I still got, let go. So there you go.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

And I think that’s relevant for a lot of people to hear, because right now, with the pandemic going on, there’s a lot of people getting, let go, and they’re trying to figure out where’s their voice.

They’re trying to figure out what is their super power. And so for them, I would, first thing I want to say is. Are, I want to ask you, I should say is something that I’ve always struggled with and I’m sure a lot of other people do as well as figuring out what exactly your niches, if you feel like you have multiple talents and use them spoken and taught on this and many of different ways, but here’s the, and I would love to hear your opinion on how you would maybe correct me because I’ve gotten, it’s a very, I wouldn’t want to say heated, but very.

I would say that I’ve been stubborn and I had a lot of conviction when I say when people tell me about finding my niche, whether it’s real estate, whether it’s personal development or whatever else I say to people. who exactly is Pat Flynn’s avatar? Because I would say that I’m a lot different than a lot of your audience, but I am your avatar.

As in I’ve consumed. I would put it up there with probably the top 5% of the concept that you’ve put out there. So as we look at this, do you feel in your heart of hearts that you really have an avatar, or do you feel like you are able to be a general rather than a specialist? What would you consider yourself

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

On paper? It seems very general, right? Because I can teach people who are just at the start of their business career or people who are six, seven figure earners and how to scale their business. I can teach people who are 18 years old, who are thinking about going to college, but want to start something on the side to the seven year old person.

or 60 year old, like my friend, dr B, who started a podcast who I was able to help. And now she teaches people how to deal and manage ADHD in their life. there’s so many different people. It’s that’s one way to niche down. It could either be a type of people. So a demographic, a certain field, Authors, real estate, et cetera. But I think also another way to niche down. And this is where I feel my niche is to hone in on a certain people’s goals. And for me, the goal of everybody despite the age is to create something of their own that they could be proud of that will help them in their career financially and give them freedom of time.

And that’s something that spans across all generations and all different kinds of spaces. And so the content that I teach, although on the surface, it can be used for a bunch of general people in general niches, the niches. Hey, you know what? I’m here to teach you business, but I’m not the guy who has Lamborghinis and I’m running out of mansion and just showing you the lavish luxury life.

And that’s why I’m doing it. I’m not the guy on the beach with, in Bali, with a laptop on my lap, sipping a martini and teaching new business. I’m not that guy. I have two kids, my Lamborghinis, the 2012 Toyota Sienna. I’m here for family though. And that’s what I’ve leaned into. And as a result of leaning into that, realizing that’s why a lot of people are attracted to me, whether they know it or not.

And because I’m authentic and different than a lot of these, especially in the internet marketing space. I mean, there’s a lot of dirty snake oil kind of people I purposefully do not associate with those people because I know that this is the space and I need to protect my people, my audience. And this audience, they have very similar goals in life and value family and, and security, and not the lavish lifestyle.

that’s not why anybody follows me. it’s for security and for family. More than anything. And yes, that’s my answer to that. But again, I started out very niche. I actually started out and this is what I recommend for you, anybody, because the riches are in the niches. That’s as I always say, even though it’s niches and I know that doesn’t rhyme as well, but anyway, the riches are in the niches.

You start out small. So you can gain more attention faster from a certain group of people and learn what their problem sets are. And in fact, when I started the smart, passive income blog, I don’t talk about this very often. There was another website called  e-how.com. I don’t know if you remember e-how.com. I write articles for E how.com any sort of how to article and you can get paid for that.

So I spent a great amount of time researching how and focusing on that niche alone for a good seven month period, where all I was doing was helping people write e-how articles. And that’s how I became known right at the start of smart, passive income, because people who found me on e-how and I was involved in forums there, and I was offering tips and things that I was learning on my other business, passing it forward to them.

I started to get shared around and I started to make a name for myself just in the little E-how community. But then that was that you might consider that one inch wide one mile deep, Going really deep with just those people. And yes, there were so many other people who wanted to make money online.

I focused just on them and then I went two inches wide. One mile one mile deep. Then I started to go, Oh, there’s other people who have blogs. You aren’t just writing an e-how, but they’re writing on their blogs and they’re trying to make money too. So then I went two inches and I found bloggers and I started to learn about blogs and started really honing in on blogging myself.

And this is where I started to learn everything I could about it. Building relationships with other bloggers, like Darren Rowse from problogger.net and Eurostar, Eric and Andy, and then learning about monetization to help them. Build a business of whatever niche that they were in. And then I expanded out from there in 2009, I started my YouTube channel 2010.

I started podcasting and then I really dove into the world of podcasts. And a lot of people know that’s where my focus is big time now. And it’s just continued to change. I’ve continued to expand that ring bigger and bigger. And I think that’s why a lot of people who’ve seen me now. They’re like, Oh, Pat can teach everything to everybody after 12 years.

Yeah, maybe. Sure. But that’s not how it was at the start. And so people try to get to where. You’re helping everybody at the start, it’s going to be a much longer, much more, vertical uphill climb. If that’s your start versus let me pick a small group of people and let me become their go-to favorite person.

Much faster and give them everything they need. And it’s funny, cause I teach a lot of students, this sort of niche down situation and they pick one niche and they’re like, ah, I don’t know. I’m worried about leaving other people out, but you’re actually better servicing those people by leaving every other person out.

And then what happens is, fast forward a year later, these people I’m like, okay, so have you branched out of that niche yet? Have you gone to my two inches wide, three inches wide, 10 inches wide. They’re like, you know what? I love this small group of people so much. I’ve just been going two miles deep, three miles.

10 miles deep with them. I now have courses and a coaching program, and now we meet in person at an event. And even though it’s small, I love these people. This is my tribe and I’m their go to resource. They’re never going to go to anybody else. And I’m like, that’s exactly why you start niche because you have options after that.<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

No, that’s a great point. And like I said, I struggled with that and I think sometimes just like you said, we don’t, I want to leave other people out and we feel like we don’t want to be considered into a box. We don’t want to be known as the one guy, like when you look at. At pad.

And I think this is the comparison thing, and this is something that I got better with over the last year. But, it was that comparison thing because you say listen, and something that I would always tell myself is the reason why a lot of people, they would want to get fortune 500 results, but they never actually look at fortune 500 companies.

So it’s just yeah. We all want to be part of the 1%, but we listen and watch what the other 99% of people say and do, That 1% of people, when you look at it, it’s like, How can I get those results? And it feels like I need to do things like them, but I think it’s all relative to put it into perspective that none of those people started out with 10 businesses upfront.

They, for the most part started out with one, they got it at least as a well ordered machine, or they got a good team in place would get systems in place. And then they went wide and then that helped them. So I think that’s a good that you put it out there. Like that

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

comparison game is dangerous.

And like When you compare yourself to others, When you have completely different lives, completely different limiting beliefs can be completely different skillsets or what have you. it’s going to do nothing, but make you either feel bad about it. It’s just never a good situation here is where I would compare because comparing is natural.

I would compare ourselves to ourselves yesterday to ourselves a week ago to ourselves a month ago to ourselves a year ago. That’s where I am competitive. With my younger self, how am I growing? How am I incrementally getting better? If you’ve read atomic habits by James clear, that 1% increase at atomic level improvement every day will grow this amazingly exponential curve, the curve.

We don’t want to flatten in your life. And when you build those on top of habits, which support your goals and your business and the life that you want it, amazing things can happen.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah, no, that’s definitely, I’m all about that for you. It looks like you’ve done everything for the most part organically, right?

You’ve just, you’ve went to, no one said that you’ve been a overnight success. You can look back at it. You see your first videos, everything, how much. w yeah, I still remember, I think I looked at this is probably it’s months to a year ago, but when you first started out and you were teaching people how to do whiteboards online and all these different videos, which is dope.

So anybody watching or listening, I would go back to that because they are cool to see where you are today versus where you started, because it gives us those perspectives. And he’s really been putting in the work. But my question to you is have you ever, was it, is there ever a point where you were doing a ton of advertising or risk?

Because it seems like you’ve always been more, risk adverse in that way that you’ve, you don’t really invest a lot into, you just allow people to find you organically.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Yeah. I mean, if by risk, you mean spending money to hopefully help get results I’ve been doing? Not that much of that.

I mean, that’s been ramping up, especially now that we have courses and we’re getting smart with our funnels and our conversion rates and all the marketing behind it. Yeah, sure. I can see that. I put a dollar in, I get $2 back. Okay. Let’s just put more dollars in, but that took years to get to that point and courses, which I didn’t start coming out with until about two and a half years ago.

So that like for the beginning, I didn’t invest a lot of money. What I did invest, however, was time. And I did invest money, not in avid, but in the learning I invested in programs from people who were, where I wanted to be. I invested in programs for people who knew podcasting or knew these other things that I really wanted to get into and that I invested time and learning and time and doing and time in failing.

I failed a lot. I think that’s why a lot of people enjoy my brand is because it’s as much about the wins and the. The rewards as it is the failures and the drawbacks and that setbacks. So that I think has been really helpful. But yeah, I mean, I, in terms of money, investment, not that much, just mostly time and I’m paying attention to the lessons that I can learn for myself.

Again, comparing myself to my earlier self pairing a, blog, post campaign, trying to promote a specific product as an affiliate to the last time I did it and trying to figure out what I can do better and always trying to improve each time.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

And I think that’s relevant now because a lot of people are wondering like, should I be investing?

Just like you said, I said $1 to try to make the $2. A lot of the times people are like, no, build a small audience first and work that audience before you start doing paid ads and everything. There’s so many ways to do it organically. And so just as cool to hear perspective of somebody who’s already got their business up there.

And if they could go back and do it again, would they invest that money sooner? So where you are now or would you still have done it the same way, which is completely organic.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I would invest my money sooner, not in ads, because I feel like, and trust me, ads are great. If you can nail the process, it’s awesome.

But I have other people who help there’s other people who can, who master that. I cannot master that. that’s not how my brain works, where I feel. I wish I would have invested money sooner is in team. Having other people support me to buy my time back. Essentially. And sometimes my sanity back for some of the things that we have to do and continue to do.

I wish I could outsource my, I wish I was smart enough to outsource my podcast sooner, not right away, because I think it’s important to try to do these things yourself, to you up front. So you can get an appreciation for the work that you do hire. So you can get an appreciation for the craft and the art of what it is that you’re hiring out for.

And so in case you hire that person and they leave, you can actually come back and support it. So you find someone, but that’s where I would hire. and I would invest in a mentor. Much sooner to, paying somebody who is a coach who can see things on the outside. And who has some wisdom in is perhaps where you want to be?

I have realized that when you’re so involved in the work that you do, there are some very obvious things that you will not see because you were so inside, right? you can’t read the label. If you’re inside the bottle. So I try to find people now, whether it’s a mastermind group or even paid coaches who can help see the label when I’m inside my own bottle and inside my own head often is really the analogy.

I would invest money sooner in team and support and also mentorship.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Got it. No, that’s great. That’s good to hear. I think a lot of people right now are wondering how they can get mentors, how they can get coaches, but they’re afraid to invest that money. And so to hear someone that’s right at your level, that’s been doing it to say, Hey, I still need coach and I still need mentorship.

So of you don’t think that right when you just make it to a level that you no longer need a coach.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I do. I remember watching tiger woods when he would win. He was in his prime. He had a swing coach. I’m like, why does tiger woods? And number one golfer in the world need a swing coach because he’s still honing in on his craft.

And he knows that there’s other people who are great about certain things that he might not be the best at, but overall he’s the best player, but there are certain skills and other things that you could still use support on.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah, I love it. Where do you go for inspiration? Obviously, I think the first thing that I would think is your family.

But outside of that, where do you go? If you’re, if you need a pick me up, are you social media in it or are you picking up a book? What does that look like for you?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Yeah, all of the above. I mean, family, for sure. Social media, definitely. but for me, for inspiration, I try to think about who have, I already have had an impact on because a lot of times inspiration is needed when I’m feeling either.

Tired or energyless, or I have some big projects I need to focus on and then trying to procrastinate a little bit. And I still procrastinate. Sometimes I’m not the perfect person and productivity person, but I know that there’s things that I can do to help myself get over those humps and those roadblocks, like we are all going to come across.

And for me, I have a couple of things. I have a pile of. Thank you notes from people who I’ve helped that to me, inspires me more than anything. Who am I doing this for? Am I going to let my fear, my boredom, my, not that excitedness about filming this course or whatever, stop me from actually helping people.

Truly being able to potentially change a person’s life. If you were in a boat and you saw a person drowning and you had the light frame, your course, your knowledge, your wisdom, whatever it is. Are you going to go? Sorry. I’m too. You scared to throw it over? Cause the water’s a little wet and I’m cold. No, that person is there and they need your help.

That’s what I imagined. I’m reminded about that. When I see these, thank you notes. And these people who have helped before in one way, shape or form, there’s also a folder in my Gmail that my assistant puts all the thank you Zen. Whenever I’m feeling down, I just go in there like literally in a minute, I’m like, what am I doing?

let’s look, let’s get back into this. There are so many more, thank you notes that I need to have. And that’s actually my barometer for success. Not social media likes or thumbs up or whatever. It’s how many thank you notes. Can I get, and I know not, everybody’s going to send a thank you note and I don’t even ask for them, but that’s how I know that if I can get that, even just from a small percentage of people, it probably means I’m doing something right.

And so I continue to go in there and I have. Thousands of them now. And I don’t say that to be cocky about it. I say that because that’s a sign that, okay. I am actually having an impact and I need to continue to do what I’m doing despite maybe not, just not feeling it one day.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah, and I loved that and I think anybody can put that into perspective right now as well, because we’re going through this pandemic can, all we’re seeing is negativity and hatred and politics for the election coming up.

And so it gets us in our own mind feeling like we’re not doing something right, or everything’s coming to an end. But if we think about the people who we’ve already championed, and that could be your younger brother, sister, your kids, someone like that, it doesn’t have to be a thank you note, but it could just be somebody who you impacted their day.

And when they come home from school, Cool. You’re like, man, like this morning, I got an opportunity to walk my son, which I’ve made most of the time here in Nebraska, in the Midwest. It gets cold really quick. But we walk to school and for me, especially not having my dad for a moment as I’m walking, I’m like is cool right now.

Like in this moment. Yeah, just him and I mom’s already gone. Like it’s just him and I, and that experience is one that gives you appreciation of life. And so

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

I think being conscious of that in that moment and being grateful for that is a huge practice that a lot of very successful entrepreneurs do is just waking up thinking about the things that they do have access to versus the things that we don’t, no matter what it is.

Yeah. And how grateful we can be. That’s such an amazing practice because then that puts in your brain. Some positive energy that you can put into your next project or two, when you get home and start working out or whatever the case may be. And to those of you who are listening, who are like, Oh, Pat, of course you get, thank you notes.

You have a podcast with 65 million downloads and you have all these courses. What about me? I’m just getting started. I don’t have that bank of thank you notes. My advice for people who are just starting out is, especially if you’re starting a business or something like that, find one person that you can help ASAP.

You don’t have to have a course. You don’t even have to have a website. Whatever it is that you think you want to teach about or build a business about find. Just one client. And even if you help that person for free, when you help that person and they get results from you, number one, it’s going to teach you a lot about what it’s like to actually help somebody in that regard.

Number two, it’s going to teach you the language that you can use with people who are going to come in later. Number three, it’s going to teach you the challenges that they are struggling with and how to actually help them. And number four, and most importantly, When you get that person, that one result, it’s going to unlock in your brain, that you actually do have this ability to help and serve other people.

So you could never say that your stuff is never helpful, or you can never ever doubt yourself again, because you’ve helped one person. It’s proven you’ve done it. And so that’s what I recommend for people when you’re starting out. Oftentimes entrepreneurs are like, Oh, I need a thousand people. My, and email us before I get started, or I need, I need a hundred clients right away to get to this income level.

sure. We can get there. Let’s start with one. I promise you, it’s going to unlock so many things for you and your energy levels. Moving forward too.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Man. I love that. And I hope that someone really takes heat to that because just like you said, it unlocked something. And then before it’s like riding a bike, you got the wind in your face.

So we just have, I have two quick questions left for you to be respectful of the time. The first one is. for looking at your journey now, and you’ve already given us so many highs and so many lows and been transparent with us. If there was one thing that looking back on your journey, if you would have implemented this sooner, it would have helped to accelerate your dream into a reality.

What is that one thing?

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Yeah, I mean, we’ve already talked about hiring other people to help, amplify that dream in reality, Besides that, and this is going to sound very tactical, but honestly, it’s a big mistake that I made is I didn’t start an email list soon enough for both my businesses by green exam Academy business, helping people pass an architectural exam.

I had the opportunity to build an email list. I didn’t, because I was like, I don’t want to invest $29 a month for an email list that I don’t know if I can grow or not. by the time it came out, come out with a product. I had thousands of people coming to my website who could have subscribed. I could have just literally sent them a note that this very helpful thing that I had was here for them.

But I felt like I had to start from scratch and just lie on the little banner at the bottom of my website. I missed out on huge opportunities to not just sell more, but also connect with my audience more and learn more about them and connect with them in a way that’s very personal and allows me to stand out and see, have them see me as a leader to be able to communicate.

And email’s still, if not even more relevant today, especially with social media and how many sort of walled gardens there are now that are blocking us from an audience that even says they want to hear from us even on YouTube. And secondly, The beauty of, an email. I mean, I mean, I didn’t do this on smart, passive income either.

I started this at the end of 2008. I didn’t start building my list until 2010. It’s just like I could have helped so many more people because email is still there, One driver of our sales in our business. And it is for several others too. It’s a tactical thing. But to me, especially in business, you’re email list is, one of the lifebloods of your business.

It’s business insurance. Because if something happens on Instagram, if you’re building a platform on Instagram, if you’re, if something happens to YouTube, if you’re building a platform on YouTube, It’s like when you still have your email list, you can take them wherever you want to go. And so that’s something that’s yeah.

Little bit more strategical and tactical, but it is something I really wish I started sooner.

Yeah. That’s the meat and potatoes though. Those are the things that people need to hear. Just like you said, especially if you’re starting in a business right now, I am an advocate. You don’t have an email list because it’s just you took me two years too late.

It wasn’t too late. Cause you could start one any day, but yeah, in the beginning that wasn’t information I got and I actually only found that out of someone’s webinars. Someone’s webinar. And I might’ve been Amy Porterfield’s. I like watched the webinar and she talked about that and I was like, Oh my God, I’m not doing that.

And so that’s crazy. I’m glad that you said that last question that I have for you. There’s someone out there that love your story, loves your path. And they want to play something similar. They want to create their own tribe, but they have that little voice in their head that says that they’re not smart enough.

They’re not strong enough. Or maybe they just don’t have enough resources. What’s that one thing that you would say to that person to get them to just. Take action.

Yeah. Somebody came up to me and they’re like, you know what? I don’t know if I’m smart enough. I don’t have the resources. I would honestly be like, prove it.

is this a truth? Or like, where is the truth in this statement? And oftentimes when I actually counter with something like that, we’ll have a really hard time. I’m actually proving that they don’t have the resources or proving that they don’t have access to something, or at least a means to go and find out information or to connect with somebody who could help them.

And so this is a mindset game, more than anything. It absolutely is. So we need to understand that we need to prove these negative thoughts, wrong and get rid of these negative limiting beliefs, because we need to stay in the positive space, because I think it was Henry Ford who said, whether you think you can, or you can’t you’re You don’t think you can do it. What they’re likely not going to have courage or the ability to do it. And then the final thing is just And this is a Pat Flynn original. It’s weird to put myself, but this apparently has a big impact on people. So I want to share it with you. I apologize, because it always feels weird quoting myself, but, maybe I do.

And you may have to say that, cause I’m just been quoting myself this whole time without mentioning it anyway. Sorry. I’m thinking too hard about this. “I would much rather live a life full of Oh, Wells than a life full of what if’s” you don’t. Want to be the end of your life, thinking about all the things that you could have done.

And what would it have been if you had only done these things now and the oh Wells, at least you gave him a chance. And I think it was Les Brown to finish off who said that the most wealthy, the richest place in this world. Is in the graveyard, right? Because that’s where all the ideas, all the inventions, all the things that people had in their brains didn’t get put into place because of fear, because of being scared, for whatever reason, they just died with them.

We don’t want to have that be the case for us. The world needs you, especially now to step up. And even if you help just one person, that’s a real human being and you will be rewarded when you serve others too. So don’t let those things die with you. Step up and live with those, oh Wells versus those what ifs.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Oh yeah. It’s funny. Cause right when you said that at first, I wouldn’t say, I thought that was perfect, but right. When you said I’ve been quoting myself this whole time, that was, would have been one of the parts where I put that, bro.

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

Go

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

man. This has been such a great conversation. I look forward to the next time we can have you on the show for anybody who wants to stay connected. with you. Where can they find you

<strong>Pat Flynn: </strong>

at? Yeah, I mean, you can find me at PatFlynn on most social media places. I’m very active on Instagram and Twitter.

I’m also available on YouTube. In fact, I’ve been going live every day. Like I said on YouTube every morning, 8:00 AM Pacific 11:00 AM Eastern come in. the members there are awesome. You don’t have to pay anything. It’s all free. And I, just continue to want to serve there. And of course, smartpassiveincome.com, or you can find all the information beginner to advanced to help you on your career as an entrepreneur, and to turn yourself into an achiever too.

Cass, thank you so much for having on thinking everybody of the dreamers out there listening. can’t wait to get connected with you again.

<strong>Casanova Brooks: </strong>

Yeah, absolutely remember DreamNation, just as he said, you have it inside of you.  You want to make sure that you take action.

Otherwise that dream will only nearly be a fantasy. That’s all for this one. We’ll catch you on the next one.